I can confidently state (the obvious) that yes it’s true europeans on the continent do drink alcoholic drinks (err duh..) – my point was that they do not have the same culture of drinking to excess that brits are so famous for. And yes, it is also true they are more inclined towards having a social cup of coffee (instead of social drink of alcohol) than brits. Eg. italian colleagues will more often buy each other a round of espresso rather than a round of alcoholic drinks at lunch. There is sadly a strong truth behind the reputation of brits, which statistics, as well as real life, demonstrate time and again. Just catching public transport on a fri or sat night after 11pm is proof enough. And I’m not only talking about the idiots either, who exist in any country (incidentally, those I count as my closest friends do not drink in this manner) – I’m talking about the every day, average worker in central london. Be it bankers, media types, IT folk, hospitality. Every company I’ve worked for here has been the same, with the same culture of drinking to excess. Its like a badge of honour they’re proud of wearing.

As for the europeans – yes they drink (again stating the bleeding obvious). And they can drink quite a bit at times – as I often saw in Germany for example (how they love their Hefeweizen beer). However.. they seem to have a better grasp of their limit. I don’t why it is, but they do – something to do with their culture and upbringing and role of families I suspect – because the issue of underage drinking is also much much less of a problem over there. I discovered that the average german tends to be able to down quite a lot of alcohol – BUT (in most cases) they can handle it! And that is the difference. Walking around there on a fri or sat night is quite different – dare I say it, much more civilised in comparison to here.

Finally – what on earth is a “soul-less greef hole”? I have no idea what cafe’s you’ve been to, but I have already commented on what I mean when I say cafe (see my prev comments pls), so I won’t go into it again.

The only time I can imagine the british pub being a “great tradition” is in the case of the gastro pub – pubs which excel in serving great food, and which people visit for the food as opposed to just the drink. Did you even read my last paragraph?

Food is a great social lubricant, however it’s not got the de-inhibitors that alcohol has. Not to mention that not all people, I’m one of them, like to be seen eating and talking at the same time.

Anyway, the line between pubs and coffee shops is already becoming blurred. Smoking is already eliminated (thank goodness), there can more comfortable seating and a coffee machine. And of course, there should be no loud music to hinder conversation.

Now a slight rant: I don’t really like the way everyone has to be categorised by or have their behaviour explained by their race, nationality, upbringing, etc. Do people have no minds of their own? If you think you sometimes have a bad time in London, place yourself in the shoes of someone who can’t identify with many British people who are only interested in drinking, but who also is shunned by people of other nationalities for being British.

Anyway, thanks for blogging about this (it only just came up in Google Reader, though – why the delay?) It allows all of us to participate in the debate, rather than just those who use Twitter or Facebook (too often I want to reply to Twitter posts but there’s no means to do so!) And sorry my reply’s a bit hurried – should be working too!

Firstly, when I say cafe, I’m thinking more along the lines of Parisian or Italian style cafes with tables out on the sidewalk… classy and chic serving good food and good coffee. Australia also has some great cafes. None of this chain costa/starbucks business. Though I don’t mind the occasional starbucks (as there usually is no alternative). But I never order coffee there as it tastes disgusting. Costa is even worse. Nero is the only acceptable one IMO. Britain really needs to pick up on its cafe act!! I make *infinitely* better coffee using my stovetop caffetiera. My italian bf can attest to that.

Secondly – maybe its to do with being chinese, but I find food a better and more genuine social lubricant (not only asians, it seems a common thing also amongst continental europeans like italians). I find it a little sad that people feel they need alcohol in order to open up enough to converse with others. Another characteristic of the british – the distance/coolness they like to keep.

But in the end, I do agree everyone is entitled to their opinion. This is simply mine.

ps Internet celebrity? Lols where did u get that idea?

I think I first off need to state that I’m personally not against the coffee shop experience. Starbucks done a lot to bring the cafe culture here into the twenty-first century. However, you have to realise that for most, the sound of the word ‘cafe’ brings forth the imagination of a greasy spoon and as such of course people want to stay away.

Personally I don’t mind where i socialise, just as long as there’s something I want to drink and the problem with cafe’s is that if you don’t drink hot drinks, your drinks are often overpriced.

Then you have to take a lot at the fact that most people who go to cafe’s aren’t actually friends to start with and so want a little edge. For example, if I’m meeting up with friends, I’ll almost certainly suggest one of our houses or it’ll be a pre-club drink. However if I’m meeting up on a date I’ll opt for the pub because when chemistry is failing, it’s not a bad idea to grab a little help from a little alcohol in your blood stream.

Being that you’re Chinese, you’ll also find that you’re a lot more sociable than the average person here. That’s something that sub-Asian culture has over the British culture. Here the idea of going for a chat is often accompanied with the practice of shopping here.

I think it’s important to celebrate people that are out with their close friends and given that the weather sucks most of the time, of course they’ll be in cafe’s and pub’s.

I don’t frown on either and totally understand the purpose of both. But ultimately, everyone is entitled to their own opinion.